How do YOU classify OTR shows?

Here is what I have so far. Do you think items should be added to or deleted from it? If so, which ones?

Note that "Juvenile" (as opposed to "Adult") is not included. Target audience is not germaine to this classification.

• Adventure
• Anthology
• Music / Big Bands (modified)
• Comedy
• Crime/Detective
• Drama
• Horror
• Mystery
• News/Documentary (modified)
• Quiz / Audience Participation (modified)
• Science Fiction / Fantasy
• Soaps
• Talk
• Unique-Misc.
• Variety
• Western
• Sports (new addition)

(This information may be used in an upcoming update of the Humongous OTR Database Search Engine. Yep, recoding the interface and expanding the database are actively under way.)

Lou

Do we not need a separate one for the kids' programs?

Methinks it is too difficult to define the difference between many Kid Shows and the remainder of OTR. In my mind, Big Jon and Sparkie was definitely intended for the juvenile audience, but was Terry and the Pirates really a kid's show? How about the Westerns ... which were for kids, and which were for adults?

If you can give me a list of shows that fit exclusively under "Kid Shows", I'd be happy to consider adding the category. Feel free to add this topic ("What are really kid shows") either here, or in your Kid's Adventure Shows BBS.

Lou

The 15 minute adventure shows (Superman, Tom Mix, Hop Harrigan, Jack Armstrong, Terry & the Pirates) were sponsored by products that kids consumed, which is one of the tests I use to determine if it's a "kids' show.

For the westerns, I use a different test. Does the horse have a name? Bobby Benson's, Straight Arrow's, and Tom Mix's did, so these are kids shows. The horses of Matt Dillon, Lee Quince, and Paladin did not, so these are adult westerns. See how this works?

Would be beneficial to have more discussion on the criteria to use. Hopefully other folks will join in.

Something like this could be very useful in standardizing what was, or was not a "kid's show".

For those who might not know - Jack's list of Kids Shows is at http://www.old-time.com/kidshows/index.html. Whether or not you agree with his list, your ideas about applicable criteria will be useful!

Lou

1) Central character is a juvenile. (Examples: Little Orphan Annie, Skippy, Jerry of the Circus, Speed Gibson, Chick Carter, Jack Armstrong, Seckatary Hawkins, etc.)

2) Sponsor has product appealing to kids. (Examples: kids cereals, candy, gum, chocolate stuff to get kids to drink more milk, etc.)

3) Hero has juvenile sidekick(s). (Examples: Sky King, House of Mystery, Red Ryder, Captain Midnight, The Sparrow and the Hawk, etc.)

4) Manner of addressing listeners. The announcer begins each commercial break with "Well, boys and girls, that was...." or "Say, kids, why don't you...." (Examples: Superman, Hop Harrigan, Terry & the Pirates, etc.)

5) The cast is virtually all kids. (Examples: Let's Pretend and Coast to Coast on a Bus. Exceptions: Quiz Kids and Juvenile Jury)

6) Hero has a "colorful" nickname. (Examples: Blue Beetle, Silver Eagle, Green Hornet, Lady in Blue, Red Lantern, etc.)

7) One of the main characters is an elf. (Examples: Big Jon & Sparkie, Mary Jane and Jump-Jump, Billie the Brownie, etc.)

If live audience, they're all kids. (Examples: Uncle Don, Smilin' Ed, Uncle Ned's Patrol, etc.)

9) The main character is an animal. (Examples: Rin-Tin-Tin, Adventures of Champion, Lassie, Billie Squirrel, etc. Exception: Hartz Mtn. Canaries)

10) Premiums offered are of interest primarily to kids. (Examples: toys, models, kids' costumes, trick rings, decoder badges, etc.)

11) Hero's horse, or other pet, has a name, advances the plot, and occasionally saves the hero. (Examples: Challenge of the Yukon, Bobby Benson, Dr. Six Gun, The Lone Ranger, etc.)

12) Standard Time Slot. Most juvenile programs were on between 4:30 and 6 PM Monday through Friday, or anytime on Saturday mornings.

Jack French

Editor: RADIO RECALL

Wel with two of your lists would you put Six Shooter in becuase Brit Ponset's horse has a name- Scar. This example would be an exception. The other one would be classifying Archie as a juvenile show becuase of rules 1, 2, 4, and 8. If you put Archie in there you might have to put Aldrich Family in there because they are similar in structure ( even though Aldrich Family was a superior show to Archie )

Regarding the various teen-ager shows, Archie, Corliss, Henry, etc. these are clearly family comedy shows. Nor does Archie fall qualify under Characteristics 2, 4, and 8. The series was mostly a sustainer and the only brief sponsor was "Swifts Meats", which only mom or pop would buy. None of the announcers talked to kids in the radio audience; they could tell from their demographic studies, it had family appeal. And, of course, anyone could be in their live audience; it was not like "Smilin' Ed" where the gallery was packed entirely with pre-teens.

If you listen to the audience in the Archie show, it does sound predominantly juvenile. Also I have at least two episodes with Kraft as the sponsor and the announcer ( I haven't the slightest idea who it was offhand ) does encourage the kiddies to ask mom to go out and buy Kraft caramels

Good one. I had envisioned "News" as encompassing that, but I can see why there could be a separate classification. However, if "documentary" is a factual exposition, is "docu-drama" a fictionalized account? If so, should there be two classifications, or just include "docu-drama" under "drama" (I tend to prefer the latter).

That got me thinking about the "History" classification as well. Hmmm. Factual "History" is probably better defined as "Documentary", and may be a candidate for deletion.

Hmmm. How about:

News/Documentary as a heading, and include the somewhat fictionalized "docu-dramas" in "drama"?

Lou

See the message at the top of this thread for the updated classification list.

Lou

Your example is a good one, and there are several other series that might fit more than one classification.

All cross-references will eventually be taken care of by the search engine. If a series must belong in two or more categories, it will be found by a search in either category, or by a search with no category selected.

Example: You Bet Your Life (and a lot of other similarly-named shows) could be found by searching for:

• the word "bet" (or any other word in the title), OR
• Genre: Quiz Show, OR
• Genre: Comedy

If the user entered the Genre: Comedy alone, lots of comedy shows would appear. Most of which he/she might not want. The search engine will allow limits to the search, such as:

• Do not include juvenile shows
• Show Comedy series only
• Show series with the words "bet your" only

That search would pretty much result in ONLY You Bet Your Life, and include all the available episodes of that series. Episodes could be limited by date range or by title content.

Version 1 of the software is now undergoing alpha test. It works. The current task get each series classified, using some kind of generally acceptable rulebase. Once the rulebase is established, the software can apply it to each listed series.

So, we are still at Step #1: identification of the classifications or genres. Step #2 will involve matching each series to the genre. I hope to get some help on that, since my classification might not match others' classifications. Shows will be allowed to fit in more than one category if necessary. Upon completion of Step #1, I'll open a thread for Step #2, to help classify the not-so-obvious OTR series.

Almost like magic, but requires the correct incantations, and a moderate amount of work and agreement

Visitors who have not as yet seen the "Old" version of the Humongous Old-Time Radio Database Search Engine, are welcome to try it out. Just click on the link, below. (The new version will be even better, and even easier to use).

Lou

A large list of shows is online. You are invited to pick out those that you think are ADVENTURE shows. All you need to do is click on the checkbox next to the show's name.

Take a look at http://www.old-time.com/polls/adventurepoll.html to for more information, and to participate in the classification exercise.

Your opinions will be submitted anonymously, and no error checking is done, so your privacy is safe and some level of propriety and knowledge is assumed.

Thanks!

Lou